is religion real ?

[Squall7]

I'm a devout Atheist. To tell you the truth, I actually think Religion should be done away with.

What I want to know is why "keep the sabbath holy" is one of the ten commandments, yet homosexuality isn't one of them. Obviously God will punish people more for working on the holy day, than for having sex with people of the same gender...

I've experienced a big argument recently with my girlfriend and her family over this issue (I thankfully kept my mouth shut). We're both Atheist, and her family is Christian (the kind that think evolution is a hoax). Her relative basically said that if there were proven links between the species, then he would become athiest. When my girlfriend told him that there have been some found, and aired in New Scientist (we're both devout readers now), yet he just shrugged it off, and basically denied it. Then my girlfriend said about the 'tree of life' being wrong, and before she could finish explaining (that its actually more of a web than a tree), he butted in again.

I'm actually with Dawkins all the way with this subject. Whilst some may argue that it's just another perspective and that neither is right, what he proposes is some serious logical flaws in religion (don't ask me to quote atm, as I don't have the book with me), rather than the Bible which is a collection of parables and stories.

Another thing I hate is when people cannot tell the difference between Atheism and Nihilism. Athiesm doesn't denote social behavioural patterns to be religious, and can keep them for the benefit of society, rather than doing away with any moral/ethical codes. Plus, people of religion tend to think that Atheists are fair game - as though they simply haven't heard the word of God, and that they will be converted if they were to become aware of Christianity's existence.

Sometimes I'm up for a good religious debate. Other times I want to just avoid the headache, because I know the other side simply 'won't get it'. I just feel that science is a better doctrine than religion.

As for the beginning of all things, M-theory explains things better than a magic man.

 

[Napalmbrain]

As for the beginning of all things, M-theory explains things better than a magic man.

M-theory is not much different from religion until they can come up with a way to test it.

By the way, why do you spell atheist as 'aetheist'?

 

[The Storm]

Wow, what an arguement. I am Atheist, I suppose. I dont like having a "label" just because i dont beleive what someone else beleives. I dont beleive the whole religion bit, it all sounds way to corny and out of whack to me. Religion, in my opinion mind you, has not been helpful to anyone in the past.

Many people claim they cling to religion for "Hope". Untrue, religion is just another thing that people will use to make themselves beleive one thing so they can shield there eyes from the truth.

In my serious and honest opinion, the only thing religion has given us is a reason to fight and kill. Look back on history, almost every war was based on religious differences. Whether it was as early as Galileo and his theory of the Universe, or as recent as World War 2 with the Jewish.

Again, this is purely my opinion, i am not trying to push it on anyone else, but it is the truth to me.

 

[Boethiah]

Many people claim they cling to religion for "Hope". Untrue, religion is just another thing that people will use to make themselves beleive one thing so they can shield there eyes from the truth.

In my serious and honest opinion, the only thing religion has given us is a reason to fight and kill. Look back on history, almost every war was based on religious differences. Whether it was as early as Galileo and his theory of the Universe, or as recent as World War 2 with the Jewish.

Again, this is purely my opinion, i am not trying to push it on anyone else, but it is the truth to me.

To the first bold sentence, how has religion been a way to shield people from the truth for the last thousands of years? The theory of Evolution is relatively recent, and Science hasn't made such strides in these fields until recently. ( I don't mean the 20th and 21st century necessarily) Before that, all religions were open for possibility.

To the second bold sentence, World War Two began because of Germany's invasion of Poland, and the U.K/France's promise to declare war. The concentration camps were not found until the Russians broke into German Territory. Although the Holocaust was a major part of the war, it did not start it.

 

[The Storm]

To the first bold sentence, how has religion been a way to shield people from the truth for the last thousands of years? The theory of Evolution is relatively recent, and Science hasn't made such strides in these fields until recently. ( I don't mean the 20th and 21st century necessarily) Before that, all religions were open for possibility.

To the second bold sentence, World War Two began because of Germany's invasion of Poland, and the U.K/France's promise to declare war. The concentration camps were not found until the Russians broke into German Territory. Although the Holocaust was a major part of the war, it did not start it.

To the first paragraph, I wasnt saying it blinded people to science or the theory of evolution. I was saying, though i shouldve explained myself more clearly, that religion has been used to shield people from the truth. In other words, it had been used for whoever knows how long to control people. Look toward before the Renassaince, around the age before the Great Explorers. The reason people wanted to find new land was to avoid religious persecution. In some countries, if you did not follow one religion, such as Catholicism, then you were hung, which in turn was against the Catholic religion itself, remember, "Thou Shalt Not Kill?"

To the second, it's true that the Jewish persecution was not the official "start" of WWII, but it was a core cause. For example, the Nazi's did not rise to power until they had a powerful leader, aka Hitler. And Hitler, aka their powerful leader, only rose to power because the Germans favored his arguements. His arguements, was a scapegoat. Germany could not stand their loss of WWI, and so Hitler gave them something to cast their hate towards: the Jews. The Jews were the "catalyst" needed to set off the chain reaction that triggered Germany's greed to conquer their long hated neighbor, Poland.

So, in that respect, Religion did help start the war, just not in so many words.

 

[Squall7]

M-theory is not much different from religion until they can come up with a way to test it.

While it's still a theory, at least if it were to be disproved, another theory would pop up that fits it better.

By the way, why do you spell atheist as 'aetheist'?

:Fixed:

 

[navarre]

In my serious and honest opinion, the only thing religion has given us is a reason to fight and kill. Look back on history, almost every war was based on religious differences. Whether it was as early as Galileo and his theory of the Universe, or as recent as World War 2 with the Jewish.

The Jewish weren't the only victims of the Holocaust. Let's take homosexuals for example: they were killed for their sexuality. Still, today, many brutal crimes are committed against homosexuals. Does that mean to say homosexuality has given us nothing but civil unrest and death and therefore shouldn't exist?

By the way, why do you spell atheist as 'aetheist'?

There's a variation in the spelling; I used to spell it 'aethiest' too.

I'm actually with Dawkins all the way with this subject. Whilst some may argue that it's just another perspective and that neither is right, what he proposes is some serious logical flaws in religion (don't ask me to quote atm, as I don't have the book with me), rather than the Bible which is a collection of parables and stories.

Dawkins really needs to chill out and go and get laid. However typical of a theist that may sound, it's true. It's like the man has devoted his entire life to destroying religion- I personally think it's sad and desperate. The God Dillusion was fine (although not itself wthout flaws), but now the guy is starting to come off as a bit of a fundamentalist. He's entitled to his opinion, but his opinion comes across as both arrogant and ignorant.

 

[navarre]

To the second, it's true that the Jewish persecution was not the official "start" of WWII, but it was a core cause. For example, the Nazi's did not rise to power until they had a powerful leader, aka Hitler. And Hitler, aka their powerful leader, only rose to power because the Germans favored his arguements. His arguements, was a scapegoat. Germany could not stand their loss of WWI, and so Hitler gave them something to cast their hate towards: the Jews. The Jews were the "catalyst" needed to set off the chain reaction that triggered Germany's greed to conquer their long hated neighbor, Poland.

Again, someone who hasn't done their homework: Hitler found it far more convenient to direct his anger towards the Communists when trying to win over the support of the German people. His beliefs and views on the Jewish people weren't considered radical but normal for the time. It was only when the Holocaust started that people found out just what an anti-semitic meglomaniac Hitler truly was.

 

[The Storm]

Again, someone who hasn't done their homework: Hitler found it far more convenient to direct his anger towards the Communists when trying to win over the support of the German people. His beliefs and views on the Jewish people weren't considered radical but normal for the time. It was only when the Holocaust started that people found out just what an anti-semitic meglomaniac Hitler truly was.

People that were'nt already in his circle. He rose to power, during the whole thing with the Holocaust. Though i do not know the specific date. And like i said in the post, the Jews were only part of the reason.

As to your other statement, I was not even talking about homosexuals, nor is this thread about homosexuals, nor did i say that only the Jews were persecuted.

 

[Napalmbrain]

The Jewish weren't the only victims of the Holocaust. Let's take homosexuals for example: they were killed for their sexuality. Still, today, many brutal crimes are committed against homosexuals. Does that mean to say homosexuality has given us nothing but civil unrest and death and therefore shouldn't exist?

Quite true. And it wasn't just Jews and gays, but also communists, Poles, Roma, and the disabled.

There's a variation in the spelling; I used to spell it 'aethiest' too.

I've never heard of that spelling before. The word is of Greek origin, so 'atheist' would be better.

Dawkins really needs to chill out and go and get laid. However typical of a theist that may sound, it's true. It's like the man has devoted his entire life to destroying religion- I personally think it's sad and desperate. The God Dillusion was fine (although not itself wthout flaws), but now the guy is starting to come off as a bit of a fundamentalist. He's entitled to his opinion, but his opinion comes across as both arrogant and ignorant.

I couldn't agree more, and I'm an atheist.

 

[Boethiah]

People that were'nt already in his circle. He rose to power, during the whole thing with the Holocaust. Though i do not know the specific date. And like i said in the post, the Jews were only part of the reason.

He didn't start the genocide until he was already in power. One of the key events in his rise to power was the burning of the Reichstag if I'm not mistaken. He blamed the Reichstag fire on the Communists. It's debatable if it was really the communist party or Hitler's goons.

 

[The Storm]

Thank you, as i did not know specifically when it started. but i beleive you are right.

 

[navarre]

As to your other statement, I was not even talking about homosexuals, nor is this thread about homosexuals, nor did i say that only the Jews were persecuted.

I know perfectly well what this thread concerns, I was simply using them as an example to counter a point you made.

He didn't start the genocide until he was already in power. One of the key events in his rise to power was the burning of the Reichstag if I'm not mistaken. He blamed the Reichstag fire on the Communists. It's debatable if it was really the communist party or Hitler's goons

Indeed, though it's common belief that Goebbels was behind it.

Quite true. And it wasn't just Jews and gays, but also communists, Poles, Roma, and the disabled.

Absoloutely.

 

[The Storm]

I understand that. i wasnt trying to sound offensive.

 

[navarre]

I understand that. i wasnt trying to sound offensive.

Believe me, if I was offended, you'd know about it.