Smash Bros Site Discussion

[LevesqueIsKing]

You are saying the exact same thing as me, just changing the words.

"makes him a more difficult character to use"=He isn't as good.

Ness is a great character...as long as he doesn't get knocked off the stage, because then its virtually an auto-ko for his opponent.

 

[samXcor3]

You are saying the exact same thing as me, just changing the words.

"makes him a more difficult character to use"=He isn't as good.

Ness is a great character...as long as he doesn't get knocked off the stage, because then its virtually an auto-ko for his opponent.

None of those statements are true. Just because he's hard to use doesn't mean he's not good. it means it's harder to get good with him, but it is entirely possible. PS its not too hard to get Ness to recover. the people who you know who use ness are probably just 14 and impatient.

 

[Monsteroids]

You are saying the exact same thing as me, just changing the words.

"makes him a more difficult character to use"=He isn't as good.

Ness is a great character...as long as he doesn't get knocked off the stage, because then its virtually an auto-ko for his opponent.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: You're funny!

 

[naisatoh]

You are saying the exact same thing as me, just changing the words.

"makes him a more difficult character to use"=He isn't as good.

Ness is a great character...as long as he doesn't get knocked off the stage, because then its virtually an auto-ko for his opponent.

By saying he's a more difficult character to use means he's more of a challenge.. Same as why people like playing games on Expert Mode. It requires more time and effort to beat, and because of this, some would argue that it's better than Normal.

It seems like a stretch, but it can be applied to characters like Ness. He's harder to use, but if you came across someone who can beat you while using your best character, you would undoubtedly give him props.

And who knows.. maybe as you progress through the Subspace, one of the later levels might require to use Lucas/Ness.. and it may be harder.. but that's why it would be a later level as opposed to the first level.

 

[LevesqueIsKing]

None of those statements are true.

...yeah...they are

Just because he's hard to use doesn't mean he's not good. it means it's harder to get good with him, but it is entirely possible.

You can only get so good with a character. Certain characters have more of a potential then others. Some characters have major weaknesses (having slow attacks, an essential attack leaving them wide open, etc.) while some characters do not. Skill can be improved, but character-specific weaknesses cannot, and they will always hold that character back.

PS its not too hard to get Ness to recover.

Are we talking about the same attack? He sits there for over a second just begging you to spike him. Go onto SmashBoards and try to tell them that tiers do not exist, you'll get flamed to hell.

the people who you know who use ness are probably just 14 and impatient.

You used that exact same comment yesterday, in my defence.

 

[naisatoh]

The people who you know who use ness are probably just 14 and impatient.

I agree with LIK here.. that's a terrible argument.

And for the sake of the discussion:

Are we talking about the same attack? He sits there for over a second just begging you to spike him. Go onto SmashBoards and try to tell them that tiers do not exist, you'll get flamed to hell.

I definitely agree that tiers exist.. but I feel that the character's ease of use contributes to their location in the tiers. And using a bottom tier character to defeat a top tier opponent means a lot more than a top tier defeating a top tier.

Also.. please refer to my previous post for more on this..

 

[LevesqueIsKing]

^Of course, I just don't like it when people try to pretend like tiers don't exist, because that would be simply impossible.

However, ease of use does not ALWAYS contribute to a characters position on the tier list. Many at E4A have reported that MetaKnight is extremely easy to get the hang of, but that it did not necessarily make him unequal to the rest of the characters.

 

[naisatoh]

^Of course, I just don't like it when people try to pretend like tiers don't exist, because that would be simply impossible.

However, ease of use does not ALWAYS contribute to a characters position on the tier list. Many at E4A have reported that MetaKnight is extremely easy to get the hang of, but that it did not necessarily make him unequal to the rest of the characters.

I agree with that statement.. but I still don't agree that:

"makes him a more difficult character to use"=He isn't as good.

I stand by my original statement that difficult characters are simply that. They have much more gradual learning curves than some of their counterparts. But the highest point of the curve is more or less the same throughout.

 

[LevesqueIsKing]

However, characters such as Fox, Falco, Marth and Shiek have no major weaknesses, whereas Ness does.

As I stated earlier, my strategy against a ness is usually just to pummel him until he's off the stage, then its a free kill. Do that five times and you win.

 

[naisatoh]

However, characters such as Fox, Falco, Marth and Shiek have no major weaknesses, whereas Ness does.

As I stated earlier, my strategy against a ness is usually just to pummel him until he's off the stage, then its a free kill. Do that five times and you win.

Well considering the only way to win is to knock the person off the stage.. I would hope that is at least a strategy you try to employ against most opponents.

And this matter will never be resolved until you have been defeated someone using Ness. And there is no doubt that there are people out there who can.

 

[Monsteroids]

However, characters such as Fox, Falco, Marth and Shiek have no major weaknesses, whereas Ness does.

As I stated earlier, my strategy against a ness is usually just to pummel him until he's off the stage, then its a free kill. Do that five times and you win.

A good Ness player gets back pretty well, in fact the one I played just wouldn't freaking die!

 

[mushroomedmario]

i have no problem recovering with ness...i nlike it because it's easy to hit your opponent and recover at the same time...meanwhile someone like mario's would probably just make it to the edge each time

 

[LevesqueIsKing]

^You hit edge guarders with Ness' recovery!?

Well considering the only way to win is to knock the person off the stage.. I would hope that is at least a strategy you try to employ against most opponents.

And this matter will never be resolved until you have been defeated someone using Ness. And there is no doubt that there are people out there who can.

Of course it is, its just that when facing Ness my strategy doesn't revolve around the knee, whereas against virtually anyone else it does.

Of course there are Ness players that can beat me. I'm just saying that I get beat by Ness less than I get beat by Fox, and thats not just because I play Fox more often.

A good Ness player gets back pretty well, in fact the one I played just wouldn't freaking die!

Interesting.

 

[mushroomedmario]

^You hit edge guarders with Ness' recovery!?

yes and it works quite good...(although keep in mind, i rarely get the chance to play people of my skill level, and when i do i usually don't play as ness)

Of course it is, its just that when facing Ness my strategy doesn't revolve around the knee, whereas against virtually anyone else it does.

Your WHOLE stratefy revolves aroudn the knee? pfft...capage

Of course there are Ness players that can beat me. I'm just saying that I get beat by Ness less than I get beat by Fox, and thats not just because I play Fox more often.

well maybe it's because the better players like fox better....
and the crappier players like ness

or if you're talking about the same people, than it could mean they just practise with fox a lot more than they do with ness

 

[LevesqueIsKing]

lol, just realized who this is. I hate avatar changes :lol:

Your WHOLE stratefy revolves aroudn the knee? pfft...capage

As does most good Falcons. I don't run around spamming it, but it probably finishes my opponent 2 out of 5 stocks on an average match. Peach's use Dsmash, Fox's use shine, Marth's use Fsmash, Falcons use Knee, whats your point?

well maybe it's because the better players like fox better....
and the crappier players like ness

or if you're talking about the same people, than it could mean they just practise with fox a lot more than they do with ness

Yes, it's all one huge coincidence :lol: