I'm extremely disappointed in the WII

[kenn]

Weak post.

Obviously you meant to say, "My weak post is as follows:

Seeing as how you used fakefanboy terminology like "horsepower," makes it pretty evident that your argument is based off of something you read. Probably some lame gaming sites review, or off a playstation forum.

Nintendo wii will sell shitloads. And everyone will shutup about the wii once they realized how hard it dominated.

I can certainly talk in terms of clock cycles per second, bits per second, bus speeds, bits processed per cpu cycle, multi-threading, merits of L2-cache on and off die if you prefer, but most quasi-intelligent people are comfortable with seeing the word "Horsepower" used metaphorically about such specific data. Clearly you aren't (intelligent or comfortable with metaphors) so I'd be happy to discuss the actual processor data sheet.

http://www-306.ibm.com/chips/techlib/techlib.nsf/techdocs/2F33B5691BBB8769872571D10065F7D5/$file/ppc750cl_ds_dd20_5oct06.pdf

That's the link to the new power pc chip. Here's a free pass for you to put one or both feet in your mouth before you respond: I work in the semiconductor industry.

 

[white89gt]

...And on the prices, i actually think nintendo make a loss on their first load of wiis... thats also why the games are so much- to get the money back in.

To add to this, I think it has become common practice for all console manufacturers to take a hit on the console and make it up on software sales.

As far as comparing the Wii to the X360 and PS3, its like comparing apples to oranges (in more ways than one, not just a specs race). The three systems were designed for different reasons and for different types of games. Does the Wii compare to the PS3 and X360 in terms of pure computing power? The answer to that is clearly no. However, I think the Wii will wind up being exactly what Nintendo was trying to create. In all honesty, I could care less about graphics and computing power. Give me a good game that will take me a while to beat, be changelling but not so much so that I lose interest, and a responsive control system and I'll be happy regardless of the machine it runs on.

 

[Inspire]

Just a couple things here, kenn.

I didn't mean to say that you shouldn't expect the CPU to scale linearly - I really mean that the GPU is on a revised architecture and that it should scale a little better than linearly. Also, I'm not so sure it's fair to compare an early P4 to a PowerPC processor in terms of scaling. The early P4's didn't scale well at all...

And... I don't consider sports-gamers to be hardcore, so i suppose we just have conflicting criteria there....

You brought up the price of the controller, but let me remind you that the wireless controllers for the 360 still retail at $50 a pop. Considering the hardware you're talking about, N doesn't have a bade pricing scheme. The problem comes in when you compare it relative to the system itself and you think 'damn, I could have almost bought a second Wii for the 3 controller setups!' But that's just the economics of it.

chessaholic, Nintendo is making a profit on every Wii sold - check out the Iwata Asks interviews. Nintendo is different from Sony and MS - they only make video games. As such, they have to turn a profit on the stuff they sell.

 

[maxpouliot]

i don't think the wii will 'flop' and the japanese developers don't think so either.. check this (from Gamespot) out :

The magazine conducted a survey with 58 developers at 19 Japanese game companies. Included in the mix were directors, programmers and designers -- the people who are making the games, rather than the people making the business decisions.

First up, a question on how much the developers expect out of the next generation systems. For the PS3, 48% said that they have extremely high expectations for the system, with 32% having just high expectations. 18% said that they don't expect much of the system at all.

The Xbox 360 got a poorer rating, with 45% saying they're not expecting much of it at all, 40% having high expectations and 13% having extremely high expectations.

And then, we come to the Wii, which seems to have the favor of the entire Japanese development community. 36% have high expectations for the system, with 63% claiming extremely high expectations. Only 1% of responders said that they weren't expecting all that much from Nintendo's new system.

Moving on to games, of the PS3's lineup, most developers were excited by Metal Gear Solid 4 (12 votes). This was followed by Final Fantasy XIII (10 votes), The Eye of Judgment (7 votes), Afrika (6 votes) and Heavenly Sword (4 votes). Other games mentioned include Bladestorm, Gran Turismo HD, Lair and Resistance.

Not surprisingly, Blue Dragon took the top spot for Xbox 360, with 18 votes. This was followed by Lost Odyssey (14 votes), Culdecept Saga (8 votes), Dead Rising (4 votes) and Gundam Operation Troy (4 votes). Other games mentioned include Lost Planet, Gear of War, Riot Act and Idol Master.

For Wii, Zelda was the overwhelming winner, with 26 votes, followed by Super Mario Galaxy (8 votes), Wii Sports (5 votes), Animal Crossing (3 votes) and Smash Brothers X (3 votes). Other games mentioned include Wario Ware, Fire Emblem, Sonic and Elebits.

The survey takers were also asked to name their favorite parts of each system. Visual power took the top spot on PS3 with 19 votes, followed by overall hardware specs (10 votes), Cell's computation abilities (9 votes), the built-in hard disk (3 votes) and the use of Blu-Ray (3 votes). Some developers also mentioned PSP connectivity, online functionality, the 6-axis control system and even the brand power associated with PlayStation and Blu-Ray.

For Xbox 360, Xbox Live was mentioned the most, getting 18 votes. This was followed by the system's ease of development (13 votes), connectivity with Windows Vista (12 votes), visual power (6 votes) and overall hardware balance (4 votes). Developers also mentioned the system's demo download service, ranking system and strength of sales in the North American market.

Nintendo's unique controller was mentioned most for the Wii, taking 34 votes. It was followed by Wii Connect 24 (9 votes), the Virtual Console (6 votes), ease of development (4 votes) and the console price (3 votes). Other developers mentioned the hardware size, the concept of moving your body, and the focus on light users.

Finally, Famitsu put all three systems against one another. In the category of system sales, 60% of those surveyed expect Wii to come out on top. PS3 took 37% of the vote compared to Xbox 360's 3%. The PS3's price point was cited as reason for the low expectations.

Most developers want to try out Wii development. 63% selected Wii as the system they most want to develop for, compared to the PS3's 32% and the Xbox 360's 5%.

Wii also won out in the category of which system the developers want the most, personally. 49% selected the Nintendo hardware. PS3 was chosen by 42%, with Xbox 360 coming in last at 9%.

 

[Inspire]

He didn't say it would flop - he said he's disappointed....

Nice link, Kenn - but, come on - 4 IPC? 10W Power Consumption @ 1.0GHz? Those are impressive specs!

 

[MetroidZ]

there will always be disappointments with everything :frown2:

 

[epikon]

nice post maxpouliot, lots of interesting figures.

 

[xpirate77]

i hear the term "hardcore gamer" being thrown around along with the thoughts on the wii not having good graphics. Um, scuse me if im horribly wrong, but wouldn't a "hardcore gamer" be more concerned with the actual playability, and fun that the console offers?..i think so

also, i played the wii, and the way i see it in my mind is as follows

.. Nintendo didn't originally want to strive to be the most powerful system, or have HD features and such things of that sort. I think Microsoft and sony got caught up in kind of a power battle, each wanting to make a system that is crazy powerful and could boast incredible specs. But no, i think nintendo stuck with what they usually do...make games fun. I played the wii a couple days ago, and ill say, the graphics werent breathtakingly amazing...but..i had fun on it..and thats what matters, and ill be there on sunday shelling out all the money i have saved on this system and games for it, simply because it is FUN TO PLAY and thats what systems are supposed to be like. Im basically saying, to compare 360 and ps3 to the wii, is like comparing apples and oranges....nintendo wasnt going to strive to have a very powerful system while microsoft and sony were, so there you go, i dont think nintendo failed in the least..

 

[kenn]

I have to agree with vagrant, OP's post screams PS3/Xbox360 fanboy.

Let me condense the OP's post into two sentences:

Waaah, the Wii costs too much; it's just a better GameCube, it should be cheaper!

and

The Wii has crappy graphics; it doesn't have 1080p resolution and 16x AA + 16x AF + HDR, why doesn't Nintendo make it more high-def!! :cryin:

These arguements are futile, the Wii has tons of advantages over the Gamecube. First off, let's just say, for theory sake, that its just a slightly better GameCube processing wise. Let's list off what's added to Wii that's not in GCN:
WiFi, completely free.
512MB of memory so you don't need to shell out $$ for mem cards
Virtual Console, Web Browser, and all the other online capable things that GCN never had.
SD card reader for even more space if needed
Free game packed right in

That list doesn't even touch on the controller scheme and it's brilliance.

I suggest the OP step back and take a reality check on how stupid it would be to implement a Wii-mote addon to the GCN. This line of thinking has been crossed before, but it's still stupid as ever. A Wii-mote addon wouldn't be able to provide full sized DVDs for more space for content, it wouldn't be able to provide all the online features, and beyond that, it wouldn't be able to provide the extra processing power needed to run the games how they look now.

I'm afraid I'm missing what "OP" is. Opinon Poster? I won't respond specifically to all your mindless drivel other than to say that I didn't state anything about high def, 1080p/i, 16x AA, etc.

I am a somewhat non-traditional gamer. I've given up on the latest generation consoles because of the very reason the WII is said to exist -- they have become entirely too complex and the focus on graphics has left gameplay sorely lacking. I'm a very non-traditional gamer in that I've always gone for gameplay over graphics. Yes, you read that right. Here is the list of systems I have or have owned:

-NES, SNES, N64 (didn't play it much), Gamecube
-Sega Genesis, Sega CD, Saturn, and Dreamcast. Awesome 1st party games like Virtua series rocked. Loved Sega Rally. Also loved the original Panzer Zwei.
-Sony PS1 and PS2. Nothing magical, just lots of games.
-Panasonic 3DO (if you even rember them). Return Fire on this console was one of the best games ever produced. Space Huld and NBA Jams were pretty slick, too.

-Game Boy, Game Boy Advance
-Sega Gamegear

I don't have now nor do I have any intention of purchasing a 360 or PS3. I am hardly a fan of either system. Great graphics, but no real games that appeal to me personally.

If you can "read between the lines", I am expressing my disappointment that Nintendo didn't push the hardware performance up (or conversely the price point down) for the WII as I was truly hoping I could get rid of all my other junk and move to ONE system. I think if the Big N had pushed the graphics envelope just a little more, the system would be a grand-slam homer instead of an in-field double, 2 RBI.

 

[Kirby64]

Not trying to flame or anything here but how can a person be a FANboy of TWO different systems? Isn't a fan someone that has passion for and loves ONE team? It seems this word fanboy is being thrown around like a hooker in Las Vegas on the internet. And quite frankly it annoys me.

By PS3/Xbox360 I meant to mean either one or the other, or more so a fanboy of high-def graphics.

PS: kenn: Urbandictionary, use it.

EDIT: As for the "Read between the lines" as kenn says, I already stated my two main points of your paragraph of drivvel were: The price is too high, and the graphics are too crappy. If you'd read more closely, you'd see I already did that.

 

[kenn]

By PS3/Xbox360 I meant to mean either one or the other, or more so a fanboy of high-def graphics.

PS: kenn: Urbandictionary, use it.

EDIT: As for the "Read between the lines" as kenn says, I already stated my two main points of your paragraph of drivvel were: The price is too high, and the graphics are too crappy. If you'd read more closely, you'd see I already did that.

Actually, Kirby, you summarized my post into a discussion of price/performance and HD graphics. I didn't bring up HD in the slightest. My oratory centered on computing power in producing textures and polygons. Your arguments are weakened because you resort to exaggeration and fallacy to try to make your post meaningful. Instead, try coming up with a thoughtful counter that isn't an attack but instead a well thought out counter-opinion. Inspire, for instance, adds well thought out commentary to his posts and if the board had a ratings system (does it?) I'd certainly put him high on the list...

 

[Inspire]

Off-topic, but, in my own self-interest - the scales on the bottom left of the individual posts allow you to use the board's reputation system.

 

[zraductus]

i first heard of the xbox 360 and i didnt care then about the ps3 and i have to tell u i was impressed then i heard about the 600 plus price tag man what a shot to the gonads i felt ill and i started to seriously ponder about buyin a xbox 360 but the only reason i would buy a ps3 is metal gear and buying a 600 console for one game would mean i would have to shell out about a GRAND and that kind of money i could buy myself a very kickass pc more kickass than ps3 and whats that about the ps3 replacing pcs in the future....???
yeah right good luck with that sony HAHAHAHAHAHAHA....
THEN it comes the NINTENDO Wii i was stocked about the system and its innovative control scheme and that even tought it was a souped up versionof the game cube i really didnt care cause since it didnt have such behemont specs i realized it would be a lot much cheaper than the other consoles
and saw zelda and i was thrilled....then i heard that remark about the wii concentrating its market to the non gamers and on top of it 250 buckss??? come on !!! are we that dumb???!! it felt like my body was 100 degrees hot and someone dumped a large can of icy cold water on me!
come on nintendo u are where u are because of loyal gamers and lil kids that plays ur kiddie games u have turn on us!!! nintendo has bled us dryand tossed us aside like a lifeless corpse......they will make one or 2 games for the hardcore gamer but in the end they dont care about us and they will make 1 or 2 games so they can make us buy theyr system and use for about 2 or 3 months and then use theyr system as a bookstand or a coacher for my drinks


i was happy about the new Wii but after reading the first post in here im sadly dissapointed in nintendo maybe ill buy it for zelda only and then ill buy myself an xbox 360.......tsk tsk tsk nintendo if u keep like that u wont last long
nintendo has been dying since nintendo 64 maybe it looked with the gamecubethe only hope it has its if they make a metal gear,resident evil or a wwe wrestling game.
but with the wii it will just get by thanks to the life support and its waiting for a noble soul that has the guts to pull the plug........shame on you nintendo

 

[kenn]

He didn't say it would flop - he said he's disappointed....

Nice link, Kenn - but, come on - 4 IPC? 10W Power Consumption @ 1.0GHz? Those are impressive specs!

Fully Agreed. Nice CPU and definitely an improvement in many ways over the current Gekko, but in my opinion just a bit short of what I think the WII should have ended up with. My only hope (but it's really a pipedream, i think) is that in the rush to get the WII to market, the current crop of games are straight ports with no efforts to take advantage of the new speed offered. Methinks, though, that the current best-in-class such as Red Steel are already pushing the graphics envelope.

 

[Inspire]

zraductus, if you were a character in a comic book, your arch-enemy would have to be F7.

I'd hate to think that the Wii would have its hardware maxed at launch, kenn. That'd be a first in the industry. Resident Evil 4 maxed the GC, and it took awhile - it also looked very good. Based on that, I'm skeptical that Red Steel has the system maxed out, but I haven't played Red Steel, either - online videos speak nothing to the graphics of a system.