Face it, Blu-Ray is needed

[Mr.Selfdestruct]

Isnt Sony losing 200 dollars on every system they sell ? And there depending on games to make up the difference ? If Blu-ray doesnt make it, (Which it wont) then you can say bye-bye to Sony gaming.

 

[Shiftfallout]

What that post failed to say was how horrible it is to program for the ps3. When you have to waste so much programming to do simple things you need to have tons of space. it has been said over and over that the 360 is much easier to program for which translates to better use of space. Also if need be I am sure Microsoft can put out a patch and allow the HD-DVD drive to be used for games. Then whalla more space. I still don't think PS3 will win this war. As long as they keep the price as it is and the average person can not afford it. No matter how much space, what media, how good the gfx, how cool it looks it still wont sell. Thats the bottom line.

lol this is what happens when you believe the rumor mill. NO, the PS3 is NOT harder to program for. It is actually made to be easier than the PS2. The cell processing uses CURRENT up to date code that is actually much easier on the programmers, only the programmers have not kept up to date on current day coding. Not hard to learn.

""At the end of the day it's just a multi-processor architecture. If you can get something running on eight threads of a PC CPU, you can get it running on eight processors on a PS3 - it's not massively different."

""PS3 is not as complicated to write for as we've all been led to believe." In fact, if the article is to be believed, the PS3 may even be easier to program for than the PS2.""

http://www.gamepro.com/news.cfm?article_id=51558

You have to keep in mind this entire "ps3 hard to program for" was a rumor started by a fired Sony employee who wrote in his blog that it was difficult for him. Though the problem lay in his poor programming skills. Unfortunately the hater tried to turn that rumor into a fact and you know how rumors work. They dont have to be based on fact to get heard.

Microsoft will not make hd-dvd used for games with the 360 because then it forces consumers to buy that $200 attachment and when somethign is offered optionally, developers rarely use it due to the fact that their product would miss out on a large part of the gaming population for that console. Far better to release a game with hardware you KNOW everyone has, thus blue ray.

M$ also addmitted they will support whichever medium is the better choice and they are open to adding a blue ray drive for the 360 or next Xbox product.

I have a feeling you are not too familiar with how things work. No worries, but what you say is based of your personal opinion and sadly I have to admit what you say is far from true.

Isnt Sony losing 200 dollars on every system they sell ? And there depending on games to make up the difference ? If Blu-ray doesnt make it, (Which it wont) then you can say bye-bye to Sony gaming.

$245 per console actually. Microsoft loses an estimated $126 per 360. The Wii actually makes a profit but thats because they are reselling a game cube. Wii has only a 700 mhz cpu as compared to the game cubes 500mhz. Microsoft makes up for their loss by charging for other features and services (including addons like wi-fi and HDdrive). Sony takes more of a loss to give the consumer more (which is admirable) and hopes to make back that loss with HOME's advertising campaign. Thus the consumer doesnt take the bite of the loss like microsofts bussiness setup.

Blue ray will make it. There is no future for HD-DVD because its about as far as they can push the dvd technology without change. Blue ray uses a "blue ray" which can read more microdata per disk and has more potential for growth. You are such a biased fool though, its hilarous. You want Sony to fail which pretty much destroys any argument you might have.

 

[Mr.Selfdestruct]

I dont know, i'd say a fired Sony programmer has one hell of alot more insight on the subject than you Shiftallout.


Weather he was fired or not, he still has more credit than you do on the subject.

Ya, this one rogue disgruntled sony programmer is gonna change the whole perspective on sony programming ease by starting a rumor.

 

[Shiftfallout]

I dont know, i'd say a fired Sony programmer has one hell of alot more insight on the subject than you Shiftallout.


Weather he was fired or not, he still has more credit than you do on the subject.

Ya, this one rogue disgruntled sony programmer is gonna change the whole perspective on sony programming ease by starting a rumor.

LOL actually he was one of the less important developers. Are you familiar with how developement teams work? Its actually said he was pulling a hoax that backfired.

Believe what you want Mr. Hater. Just know this, I know more than you. :wink:

 

[WII60]

blue ray sucks face it and get onb with your life

so how does the future suck...tell us?

 

[paintba||er]

Blue ray uses a "blue ray" which can read more microdata per disk and has more potential for growth.

Doesn't HD-DVD use the same blue lasers? HD-DVD has the porn industries support too. I'm still undecided as to which next generation disc format to use. Right now I'm slightly leaning towards Blu-ray

 

[Mr.Selfdestruct]

Oh ya shiftallout, the HD-Dvd also uses a Violet (Blue Ray).


Guess you dont know as much as you think smart ass, ha ha ha.


I dont want sony to fail, they make other good products.


Shiftallout, you know enough to only point out the good aspects of PS3, and leave out the bad for the sake of your argument, you are the most biased guy on the site.

You dont have a balanced non biased opinion on Ps3 yet you expect everyone else to. Your a F**k stick.


For such a biased fool, I, unlike you studied up on both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray, your dumbass didnt even know that the HD-DVD uses the same blue ray !! Walk on home boy, walk on home.


SO are you standing by your statement that PS3 will soon come down in price, or do you like that egg on your face ?

 

[Shiftfallout]

Doesn't HD-DVD use the same blue lasers? HD-DVD has the porn industries support too. I'm still undecided as to which next generation disc format to use. Right now I'm slightly leaning towards Blu-ray

Yes, I stand corrected as I did not mention that HD-DVD uses the similar blue laser but they are very different.

s Blu-ray the same thing as HD-DVD?


No, HD-DVD (previously known as AOD) is the name of a competing next-generation optical disc format developed by Toshiba and NEC. The format is quite different from Blu-ray, but also relies heavily on blue-laser technology to achieve a higher storage capacity. The format is being developed within the DVD Forum as a possible successor to the current DVD technology.

3.2
What benefits does Blu-ray offer compared to HD-DVD?


Although both Blu-ray and HD-DVD are similar in many aspects, there are some important differences between them.

The first is capacity. Because Blu-ray utilizes a lens with a greater numerical aperture (NA) than HD-DVD, the laser spot can be focused with greater precision to fit more data on the same size disc. This allows Blu-ray to hold 25GB per layer (50GB on a dual-layer disc), whereas HD-DVD can only hold 15GB per layer (30GB on a dual-layer disc). Blu-ray has also adopted a higher data transfer rate for video and audio (54Mbps vs 36.55Mbps). The greater capacity and data transfer rates for Blu-ray will allow the movie studios to release their movies with higher quality video and audio than the HD-DVD format.

The second is content. The Blu-ray format has received broad support from the major movie studios as a successor to today's DVD format. Seven of the eight major movie studios (Warner, Paramount, Fox, Disney, Sony, MGM and Lionsgate) have already announced titles for Blu-ray, whereas HD-DVD only has support from three major movie studios (Warner, Paramount and Universal). This is an important difference because some of the studios might only support one of the formats, so you won't be able to get your favorite movies in the other format. Choosing the format with the most content support minimizes this risk.

The third is hardware support. The Blu-ray format has broad support from the world's leading consumer electronics, personal computer and media manufacturers, including Sony, Panasonic, Philips, Samsung, Pioneer, Sharp, JVC, Hitachi, Mitsubishi, TDK, Thomson, LG, Apple, HP and Dell. The Blu-ray format will also be supported in the next-generation PlayStation 3 (PS3) video game console. This means that you will have a lot of choice when it comes to players and hardware. The HD-DVD format has far less supporters, so the amount of players and hardware will be very limited. Currently, Toshiba is the only company offering a stand-alone HD-DVD player.

Oh ya shiftallout, the HD-Dvd also uses a Violet (Blue Ray).


Guess you dont know as much as you think smart ass, ha ha ha.


I dont want sony to fail, they make other good products.


Shiftallout, you know enough to only point out the good aspects of PS3, and leave out the bad for the sake of your argument, you are the most biased guy on the site.

You dont have a balanced non biased opinion on Ps3 yet you expect everyone else to. Your a F**k stick.


For such a biased fool, I, unlike you studied up on both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray, your dumbass didnt even know that the HD-DVD uses the same blue ray !! Walk on home boy, walk on home.


SO are you standing by your statement that PS3 will soon come down in price, or do you like that egg on your face ?

lol your such a sad person. I said that I did not make it clear that they use similar laser technology. My point was that they are completely different and I stand by that. Im sorry if you are too stupid to comprehend what I wrote without spinning it in some wayward direction. If you read closely you might have seen where I said that blue ray builds off of what the DVD started. Oh your smart now arnt ya lol.

I know only the good points of the PS3? Thats funny because if have bothered to read my posts here before you started joining in, you would have realized I consistantly talk about how good the 360 GPU is. That the 360's gpu is better than the PS3's. Im sorry if you have selective reading skills. I pity you.

And yes, in an interview Sony admitted to planning for a price cut but can give any details as of yet though they plan on having it around the time of some of their big releases. I never said when. That's you reading like a retard.

Keep it up chimp..er champ. One of these days you might not be such a douche. :wink:

 

[Mr.Selfdestruct]

So, you just discredited yourself.

The all knowing source of Blue-Ray information, hasnt really done his homework.

And you also didnt respond to the fact that Sony cant drop there price like you stated earlier in one of your posts. Because sony is so far in the hole on the PS3 as it is. Heck you even said yourself in the post above that its actually more like 240 dollars Sony is losing per PS3, and even knowing this information, how did you come up with the conclusion that PS3 will come down in price soon with there console ?


Instead of taking all of those programming classes, it sounds like you should of took some business classes, that simple economics bruda .

 

[Shiftfallout]

So, you just discredited yourself.

The all knowing source of Blue-Ray information, hasnt really done his homework.

And you also didnt respond to the fact that Sony cant drop there price like you stated earlier in one of your posts. Because sony is so far in the hole on the PS3 as it is. Heck you even said yourself in the post above that its actually more like 240 dollars Sony is losing per PS3, and even knowing this information, how did you come up with the conclusion that PS3 will come down in price soon with there console ?


Instead of taking all of those programming classes, it sounds like you should of took some business classes, that simple economics bruda .

Are you a #$%&ing stupid? How many times do I have to say it? They never said "soon". They mentioned they would try to tie it in with a big release. AND yes, in this day and age its common for consoles to take hits when selling their systems. This is why consoles rely on their games and secondary means in which to get back that profit. In Sony's case their long term plan includes increased sales of Blue Ray movies which they profit from, Online marketing with HOME, which they can get money from, Games, and their online store.
Whenever a console first starts off in this day and age, they take a loss. ITS CALLED INVESTMENT. Im sure your too young to understand that right? When a company invests in something, they usually take the hit but look foward to the long term benefits. Did you know Microsoft is still in the red? Yes they still have yet to make a profit off of their 360. Dee dee dee. Gee yer smart kid. lol
Just because a console takes a loss, it doesnt mean they cant have a price cut. WHen a price cut happens, usually the company has other sources of income starting to flood in, there for its expected that sony will have HOME's marking scheme up and running before they make those price cuts, which would tie in usually around a big release which... yes will usually fall around a heavy shopping period such as christmas.

Get a clue kid. get. a. clue. I know you cant understand the system, and that your so stubborn you would never admit anyone else is right. You are too stuck up with your own false smarts that it makes me wonder how bad your insecurities are. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. Pretty much a waste of time.

 

[Mr.Selfdestruct]

Its so funny to hear you call other people biased, apparently everyone on her is biased except you!

Thats all you do, when you start to lose an argument and cant back up statements, you turn to attacking people for their spin of a subject, which conincidentally is exactly what you do.

Somewhere in your mind you actually believe your thinking is fair and balanced on this subject, its such a load of crap.

YOU DIDNT EVEN KNOW HD-DVD used a blue/violet laser, and you immediately back tracked your statment by saying you simply chose not to point that out at that particular time. Wow, man thats a pretty unbiased thing to do.

Who do you think your fooling ? The POSSIBLILITY that sony will lower the price on there PS3 (possibility pfff), at some yet unanounced future date is total HORSE CRAP, because if you really read those articles, then you would also know that every person who wrote on the subject STRESSED that sony would not be lowering prices for the PS3 for various reasons, including the fact that Microsoft would simply lower theres to offset PS3's attempt, HELL they even said that Sony wouldnt lower the price even 50 bucks !

As for your pathetic attempt to compare Microsoft to Sony as far as money loss and there ability to absorb losses, MICROSOFT can afford to BUY SONY twice over you fackin dip shiaaat, now go turn your flat billed fitted hat sideways get a mystic tan and pretend your not a Westcoast Metro Sexual douche bag living in the O.C.

 

[paintba||er]

Damn, just give it up. No one ever wins an argument against Shiftfallout.

 

[Shiftfallout]

tell me where I said that HD-DVD didnt have that blue ray laser? You cant because I never said it. And no I am not biased, I like all 3 systems. I own all 3, and I do not wish any one of them to fail. The PS3 is a great system. Thats a fact I stand by and I am more than happy to combat the ignorant misconceptions that float around on this forum. Keep it up kid. Your worse than masterjedi2u, and if you keep it up you will probably end up following him to ban city.

 

[raisinghelen]

I read a few posts here (by people supposedly in the film industry) saying that Betamax was widely used and was still used for film making. Surely they meant Beta SP and not actual Betamax??

I dont think that Blueray is really needed for games yet. I remember when CD consoles first appeared and i thought the access times were horrible. As far as im aware Blueray access times are slower than HDDVD so if a Blueray disk was full to capacity i would imagine that the load times could be painfull. With game development costs being so high now too i doubt that many developers could afford to fill a Blueray disk either unless the game was a guaranteed success.

Blueray may have potential and perhaps in the future it may become the standard but it isnt exactly needed right now. Sony's Blueray plan wasn't for the benefit of gaming, it was to push the movie format to as many people as possible but in doing so they have alienated the PS3 from the mass market that loved the PS1 and PS2.

 

[Shiftfallout]

I read a few posts here (by people supposedly in the film industry) saying that Betamax was widely used and was still used for film making. Surely they meant Beta SP and not actual Betamax??

Obviously the technology has evolved since 1982's betamax. I mean that betamax as a form of technology is still being used. Thus I mentioned the betacam, which then turned into other forms of "beta" products within the film industry. Surely you must have realized this? nice try though.

I dont think that Blueray is really needed for games yet. I remember when CD consoles first appeared and i thought the access times were horrible. As far as im aware Blueray access times are slower than HDDVD so if a Blueray disk was full to capacity i would imagine that the load times could be painfull. With game development costs being so high now too i doubt that many developers could afford to fill a Blueray disk either unless the game was a guaranteed success.

You are entitled to your opinion. It is a fact however that developers are struggling to really fit many of their games on todays dvds. Games that have to be compressed, ripped and squeezed onto these game disks. In the PC gaming world, games have already been making their way upwards of 10 gigs.
The PS3 load times are about the same as the ps2. It is an over exageration that the load times are long. Did you bother reading the main article? Games like MGS4 are filling up blue ray disks. Games like the Darkness are able to pack it full of added content compared to its dvd-9 360 counterpart that will not include that content.

They are also planning that any video game's you buy based off movies will be able to include the actual movie along with the game discs. Pirates of the carribean 5 comes out and if you buy the game you get the movie too (for example).

A bigger storage medium is needed for todays next gen gaming. New storage mediums always have a rough start. CDs were the same, DVDs and yes now Blue Ray.

Blue ray's data transfer rate: 36.0Mbps (1x)
54.0Mbps (1.5x)
DVD:11.08Mbps (1x)
HD-DVD 36.55Mbps (1x)

"Blu-ray also has the potential for much higher speeds, as a result of the larger numerical aperture (NA) adopted by Blu-ray Disc. The large NA value effectively means that Blu-ray will require less recording power and lower disc rotation speed than DVD and HD-DVD to achieve the same data transfer rate. While the media itself limited the recording speed in the past, the only limiting factor for Blu-ray is the capacity of the hardware. If we assume a maximum disc rotation speed of 10,000 RPM, then 12x at the outer diameter should be possible (about 400Mbps). This is why the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) already has plans to raise the speed to 8x (288Mbps) or more in the future."

Blueray may have potential and perhaps in the future it may become the standard but it isnt exactly needed right now. Sony's Blueray plan wasn't for the benefit of gaming, it was to push the movie format to as many people as possible but in doing so they have alienated the PS3 from the mass market that loved the PS1 and PS2.

I dont think so. You say that by including the Blue Ray, the PS3 has alienated gamers. All it has done was rise the price tag a few. Remember people were not buying the $499 model because they wanted the $599 model. Now that the $499 model was scrapped because of this, people are complaining about the $599.

Sonys plan for blue ray is not just movies. Its possible to have multipul results from one product. On one side, blue ray is backed by many of the film studios here in Los Angeles. On the other side, Blue ray helps cut down on piracy within gaming, more protective measures can be taken and put on a blue ray disc, developers are happy with the needed space and they plan on using as much of that space as possible. Games like Gears of War for the 360 became short due to the medium it was made on, however if it were on an HD-dvd or evenbetter a Blue Ray disc, the developers could have included a much more and would not have had to limit the game size.

People keep saying the PS3 is too much money, but thats just an excuse. Its not that expensive. No more so than the 360. Theres a reason sony offers free internet play, adds the wi-fi, pc hard drive, cell processing, blue tooth..ect You are getting a lot for that 199$ more which you still end up paying for the 360 sooner or later.