I'm new to consoles, why no game backups?

[austinAlan]

I can't believe that I have this flimsy DVD as my only copy of an expensive game. Please catch me up on why we're being screwed or can I make a copy and play it without mod chipping the console? Will game companies send a free new copy of a game if you send them a broken disk say a year or so after purchase?

 

[arcticreaver]

you can save the files on SD card.

 

[[DT]]

He's talking about the original game media NOT saved games.

DVD's are reasonably robust - I've never had an original DVD (movie or game disc) go bad. They're not fragile (buy a blank and try to snap it in half), just prone to surface scratches if they're left out and tossed around (and even then, the error correction system in most readers can handle a fair amount of scuffs).

I agree that $50-60 isn't chump change - so I'd be diligent to return games to their cases after playing to keep them mint!

FWIW, Gamecube games has explicit notice in the package that "Backup or duplication even for archive was not permitted by law" (something to that effect). I believe they had a media replacement warranty for like 12 months.

~DT

 

[austinAlan]

He's talking about the original game media NOT saved games.

DVD's are reasonably robust - I've never had an original DVD (movie or game disc) go bad. They're not fragile (buy a blank and try to snap it in half), just prone to surface scratches if they're left out and tossed around (and even then, the error correction system in most readers can handle a fair amount of scuffs).

I agree that $50-60 isn't chump change - so I'd be diligent to return games to their cases after playing to keep them mint!

FWIW, Gamecube games has explicit notice in the package that "Backup or duplication even for archive was not permitted by law" (something to that effect). I believe they had a media replacement warranty for like 12 months.

~DT

Well you're probably right that they will last as long as I want to play them. I'll chill out.

I bought a used Zelda from a retailer and it had a tiny scratch that made it completely unplayable. Luckily they refunded the purchase but still it's not as indestructible as book for example.

 

[[DT]]

Yeah, the used/preowned stuff can be a little sketchy! We've been on Netflix for years, and I'm amazed at some of the DVD's we get.

Hahaha, they look like someone went over them with an orbital sander! Our downstairs DVD player is a little fussy too - we've had to migrate to the cheaper Sony upstairs on a few occasions to finish a movie! I'm always happy when we get a movie early in its circulation, befire kids have had a change to toss it around outside...

Used stuff I always try to check out the disc, and then immediately boot it at home just to confirm it will fire up.

I also try to keep my "loan circle" down to a few folks I know are as hardcore about taking care of stuff as I am, so I know I'll get it back in the same condition as I loaned it.

Kind of a sidebar, but one of the selling points of BD (Blueray) is the media is supposed to be super resilient because of the final mastering process.

 

[austinAlan]

The Zelda flaw I had was very small and if you played the disk it went cleanly through the opening and died when you pressed A to continue. It was hard to fault anyone for that one except the person who sold it originally because you know they knew it didn't work.

 

[sremick]

FWIW, Gamecube games has explicit notice in the package that "Backup or duplication even for archive was not permitted by law" (something to that effect).

Companies say lots of things. They aren't always true and they aren't always held to any standard of having to tell the truth.

In other words, just because Nintendo made a claim about the law doesn't make it true, and just because it has/was allowed to persist doesn't mean it was ever contested/proven/etc.

In this case, the law would seem to contradict what Nintendo is trying to claim:

http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#117

 

[bigwilliiy]

i thinks what thats trying to say is that you can burn a game (or computer thingy) AS LONG that you dont use it for selling puposes

 

[sremick]

i thinks what thats trying to say is that you can burn a game (or computer thingy) AS LONG that you dont use it for selling puposes

Right, which is what the OP, austinAlan, wanted to do... and what Nintendo was/is trying to say you can't do (as mentioned by DT).

What the law actually says and what Nintendo is trying to say it is appear to be quite different.

 

[bigwilliiy]

well, you got the government behind ur back so if nintendo tries doing something you got evidence that you havent broke the law

 

[[DT]]

Companies say lots of things. They aren't always true and they aren't always held to any standard of having to tell the truth.

In other words, just because Nintendo made a claim about the law doesn't make it true, and just because it has/was allowed to persist doesn't mean it was ever contested/proven/etc.

In this case, the law would seem to contradict what Nintendo is trying to claim:

http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#117

Not at all - FYI, I have some legal background and have done some consulting in copyright law, derivative work, IP/IC, etc.

The law cited only implies coverage for the content in question - Nintendo could lobby that video game media doesn't fall into "computer program" but under the Title codes that protect entertainment media. I bet there's a 1000 page license agreement locked up in the Nintendo tower that covers all the esoteric details.

Not to mention (and this could be the clincher), if making an "archive copy" requires bypassing copy protection, the act of making a usable copy violates a handful of laws in and of itself. This is/was the sticky situation for companies producing DVD/DVR/Ripping type devices - DVD CCA said it's OK to copy them but not bypass DRM.

Er, OK, so that's like a yes, but not really :lol:

For that matter, you might even argue that copy protection in itself violates Chapter 1/Section 117 as it disallows you to make that archive copy which you are supposedly entitled to do.

I do know that the Feds cracked down in the US on dozens of ModChip companies and those people are potentially facing serious charges (i.e., a device to bypass copy protection, even if it's marketed for "archive copies" violates some interpretation of Chapter 1/DRM/DMCA).

Good food for thought though :thumbsup:

~DT

 

[sremick]

Right, I'm aware of the Fair-Use vs. DMCA contradiction. They have yet to resolve that one for good in court. You'd think that the people who pass the laws would sort out fundamental (and blatantly-obvious) stuff like this before passing the laws, but welcome to the USA.

But... do Wii discs have any sort of copy protection?

 

[[DT]]

Right, I'm aware of the Fair-Use vs. DMCA contradiction. They have yet to resolve that one for good in court. You'd think that the people who pass the laws would sort out fundamental (and blatantly-obvious) stuff like this before passing the laws, but welcome to the USA.

But... do Wii discs have any sort of copy protection?

[ edit: wasn't sure what the language tolerance was in here ]

They must, I've been trying to copy the dang things for months!




























I kid, I kid :ciappa:

 

[austinAlan]

Well that makes some sense, ie the "it's legal to copy but not legal to crack/hack or whatever the DRM."

Of course it's just data on a disk ultimately and it does seem to me that creating a hardware reader that could read it bit for bit and reproduce it irrespective of the content of the software should also technically be legal IMO.

Oh well.

 

[SensesFail]

Yeah, the used/preowned stuff can be a little sketchy! We've been on Netflix for years, and I'm amazed at some of the DVD's we get.

switch to Blockbuster. havent had a broken DVD since i switched over. AND a free in store game rental every month, seven dollar value, AND in store free rentals (now rivaled by netflix's online movies though, hows that work btw?)

anyways on topic.. DVD's are reliable enough.. just dont treat your 50 dollar purchase like crap!